ok Big 12 / SEC challenge
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truehawk93 said:
Freaky low scoring game in Ames, weird…Not the Clowns we play and know
Tennessee is a top 10 Kenpom team with the #12 adjusted defense. ISU is young. Bad combo.
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Great game for UVA in Cameron…great win
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@BShark If #22 can go into Ames and win like that, what will KU do at around #5?
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Probably have a really close game.
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What’s the conference challenge score right now?
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@truehawk93 KU should’ve stomped ISU in AFH but didn’t, it’s never easy on the road if you’re Kansas especially in Ames.
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Yep…mystery why KU can’t take care of business. Actually even with the loss at OU, they have been playing on the road fairly well.
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@truehawk93 we have played better on the road than at home to this point. Even at OU we controlled about 25 minutes of the game and crapped it away at the line.
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Faylor - L
TCU - L
ISU - L
OU - L
KU - W
KSU - W
UT - W
TT - W
Need Pokes and WVU to get wins.
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@truehawk93 The most disappointing performance was TCU…Vandy was like 7-13 for gosh sakes.
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WVU just putrid on offense for awhile now.
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TCU should have won, OSU had several chances to win and could not score, two critical TOS by Young handed the game to Alabama. West Virginia desperately trying to give the game away with a little help from the refs; two of the fouls on Konate were pure BS, even Bilas took a time out from sucking up to UK to criticize the refs.
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@truehawk93 OSU lost and WVU may go down. And, it’s not just that the B12 may go 4-6 against the SEC (at best 5-5) - it’s arguably worse than that. ISU and Baylor got absolutely spanked. TCU lost to a lousy Vandy team. OU lost to an average Alabama team. Not a single B12 win was a dominant - TX and KU the biggest margins.
The question is what does this augur for the tournament? I know there is a lot of passionate debate about this, but this notion that the B12 is the best conference (by Kenpom or RPI) is flawed - the B12 is the most balanced conference, and there are no bad teams (ISU on the brink). And, the B12 teams had a great non-conference record, but it was primarily a function of avoiding any bad losses and picking up a lot of solid wins.
The problem is that year in and year out, the B12 teams do not consistently play and beat the better teams from the power 5 conferences. This year was no exception (the exception being WVU’s win over UVA (their only loss)).
I very much hope I’m wrong, but my fear (and prediction) is that yet again the B12 teams will significantly underperform in the tournament (absolutely and relative to seedings). Happy to eat crow if that doesn’t turn out to be the case…
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@DCHawker To me the only truly surprising result was TCU Vandy.
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I don’t think anyone has said there is a big time FF contender in the big 12. KU, WVU and perhaps Texas Tech have an outside chance but are realistically S16/EE teams at best. Like you said, it’s a balanced league with no truly terrible teams.
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The argument for the B12 being the best conference will take a hit regardless of if WVU can beat UK. The SEC is probably the 4th best conference. I hoped we would win the challenge as a conference but I care more about what happens in Lawrence to be honest.
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I only care that KU won today.
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Kentucky should win this now tbh.
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That dunk will do it! Good night!
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Smh @ the lil10. What is it March already?
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Today was just a sneak peak of the tourney.
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Florida and Tennessee are the #2 and #3 teams in the SEC while ISU and Baylor are the bottom 2 teams in the Big 12 so not necessarily unexpected. WVU, OU an TCU should have won. Disappointing show by the conference to say the least.
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The SEC gets its first win in the 5 year history of the challenge and in a year where arguably their best team in Auburn didn’t even play. Not looking good for the little 12 once again.
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JayHawkFanToo said:
Florida and Tennessee are the #2 and #3 teams in the SEC while ISU and Baylor are the bottom 2 teams in the Big 12 so not necessarily unexpected. WVU, OU an TCU should have won. Disappointing show by the conference to say the least.
I was trying to drive this point home earlier about Tennessee. If Tennessee was a traditional power they would be ranked higher right now imo.
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Has Huggins lost his team? Or are they just tired? Pressing all the time taking it’s toll? I mean. I know they’ll be ready and give us a run or beat us in our building cause that’s the way of things… But what’s up with them. They were so hot just a few games ago.
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cragarhawk said:
Has Huggins lost his team? Or are they just tired? Pressing all the time taking it’s toll? I mean. I know they’ll be ready and give us a run or beat us in our building cause that’s the way of things… But what’s up with them. They were so hot just a few games ago.
They just got smothered by UK’s lengthy athletes in the 2nd half. Once UK stopped turning it over (so, their own mistakes) they basically took control. Took some wild shots for WVU to stay in it. UK will be a tough out in the NCAAT for anyone.
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@BShark not saying you’re wrong. I was looking deeper than just today’s game though. They don’t seem to be what they did just a couple weeks ago honestly.
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@DCHawker you’re not wrong. We’ve all seen it happen on an annual basis. There’s no reason to believe this year is any different. All the numbers and the ratings and yada yada. We see it’s all talk when nobody really walks the walk after weekend 1 largely. Ratings and numbers don’t earn respect. Post season wins do. It’s gonna take an improvement in that area before anyone really believes the lil10 is the top conference.
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@cragarhawk Imo WVU’s system marginalizes talent. They played 11 guys today. They foul it up. It helps them hang with more talented teams but it also imo prevents them from ever being elite.
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Well, the Big 12 didn’t show - -stand up much today. - - - We did our part , - - Texas surprised but the margin a little bit , K-State is going strong , & Texas Tech managed to pull it out.
Baylor continued to look like warmed over dog doo , I still say Iowa state is not that good - - ya , I know they played us tough but who hasn’t , I mean 45 points for a game - that’s not going to win you much.
Oklahoma State played a little better then I thought they might considering they were without Shine and another key player had a perfect chance to win on their final shots.
West Virginia - -really struggles on the offensive end - to much damn one on one dribbling everyone just standing around. - -Carter a lot of times just dribbles at the top of the key , shot clock gets to low before they try and get in any kind of offense and then a lot of the time they have to force, - just not good offense.
So with that behind us , now time to get bad to the real matters at hand - -Big 12 race , we have a huge game Monday, I’m not gonna predict a win for sure, gonna be really hard the way squeak’s boys are playing right now. Hell they actually seem to be playing BETTER since stokes has been out. - -Got to strap it up , another rough game in the Big 12.
Yes of course now we get to hear the rest of the year how the Big 12 is over rated once again , from every other fan base – -probably right. I’m not to sure but what K-State might not crack the top 25 this week - like 23-25th - -time to roll. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@BShark @JayHawkFanToo ISU and Baylor losses not unexpected - they lost to 2 of the better teams in the SEC. But, when have we won by more than 20 at Hilton?
Did the B12 really get any good wins out of this? KSU had to come back to edge an average UGA team at home. KU should have won at AFH. TX beat a second tier at best team at home. TTU was a solid win against a decent SC team, but that was still #14 against unranked. 2 of the best 4 B12 teams lost, one on the road the other at home.
The SEC is better and deeper than in year’s past, but still…
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I think people confuse the big 12 being the best conference with it being the most competitive conference, which since it’s been at 10 teams I believe to be fairly accurate.
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@DCHawker You won’t find me defending the B12 today. I’m just not surprised. I thought people who were thinking WVU would wax UK were nuts.
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I don’t agree. Teams always play League rivals tough. KU always gets the best game of the season from all the other Big 12 teams, likewise, UK tends to get the best of other SEC teams and just lost to South Carolina, a game it had no business losing and it also lost to Florida and Tennessee. Regardless of how bad ISU is, it will always give KU a tough game, particularly at Hilton, and so will KSU.
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How did WVU lose? When I saw halftime score, I’d banked it in the W column.
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kjayhawks said:
I think people confuse the big 12 being the best conference with it being the most competitive conference, which since it’s been at 10 teams I believe to be fairly accurate.
This is exactly right. Perfect way to explain it.
We’ll see what March brings, which is the only true measure of national power.
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@JayHawkFanToo I’m not sure what you are disagreeing with? I agree that league rivalry games will tend to be tighter, not so much because teams “get up” for KU (or UK), but because of familiarity - they know our schemes so well and can better disrupt offensive sets.
The issue is how B12 teams perform against better teams when they don’t know their tendencies. Tennessee is a better team than ISU this year. But to lose by 20+ at home, esp. after being up by 8 early in the game?
But it goes beyond ISU yesterday. The fact is the B12’s wins all came against teams in the bottom half of the oft derided SEC (not a one with a winning record in the conference). We couldn’t get a win against any of the top half, and didn’t have to play Auburn, which leads the conference now.
Again, I hope I’m wrong, but I fear this signals another crash and burn by the conference in the tournament. Good coaches across the conference, but simply not enough depth of talent to succeed against the top half of at least the ACC teams, and perhaps the SEC, P12 (we lost to 2 mid-tier P12 teams), BE and B10.
How many wins does the B12 have against teams that have any realistic shot at the FF (even the E8) - I would say just 2 - UVA and UK. Until conference teams regularly schedule and demonstrate they can win regularly against the best teams from the other power conferences, I expect it will be rinse and repeat…
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Well kind of hate to say it, but - -came pretty damn close as to how these match ups would tur out. - -went 7-3 , missed on the Oklahoma game , missed the TCU game - -& missed the South Carolina game. - -Like others have said it really does look as thought every year the Big 12 gets all the hype about being the toughest conference and then - - -we get things like this -we see how it plays out in the tourney so day we are going to have to back up the talk. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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As others have said, yesterday was a preview of what will happen a month and a half from now. Every team in the Big 12 gets up to play us but as we have seen, each is more than capable of laying an egg. OU from yesterday is a great example.
All I really care about though is how well KU does. If Tech flops in the first round, I dont really care that much.
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BShark said:
@DCHawker You won’t find me defending the B12 today. I’m just not surprised. I thought people who were thinking WVU would wax UK were nuts.
ya, not me. I didn’t think WV was gonna win this game - -I had Kentucky picked - -WV goes through to long of droughts where their offense sucks. - Carter just stands out top and dribbles then the shot clock runs down to where it is to short and they have to force things. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@CRH107 I am going to the ou, Texas and w Virginia games. Watching the game at home and gotta shout out the announcers! How refreshing. Guys that were respectful of AFH! Took a pic of my g daughter w/holly after game. If you haven’t heard her story, look it up, impressive! Not talking cancer, but her start in sports. It was a great day to be a Jayhawk! Hoping for a repeat tomorrow!
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@Crimsonorblue22 I’m covering for you at the OSU game next saturday!
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Bracketology has 7 Big 12 teams and KU with a #1 seed.
Interesting write up on the NCAA web site about the Conference.
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Looks like Mizzou will be one player short, PG Terrence Phillips indefinitely suspended.
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@JayHawkFanToo Great share, thanks.
I liked the Graham interview.
I liked Jevon Carters non-answer to what its like to play for Huggins “Pause. More pause. Well, uh, you know, main thing playing for a legendary coach, I couldn’t pass that up. I wasn’t highly recruited coming out of high school, I couldn’t pass that up.”
I liked the Graham interview.
And lastly, I liked this line from the article as I’ve wondered about the same thing: “The various computer power ratings love the Big 12. So as the conference of fickle fate recommences, here’s what you wonder: Are the recent scores reflective of teams starting to show flaws, or the inevitable bleeding when you go swimming with sharks?”
When the other B12 teams do their early exits every year from the dance, is it because our conference isn’t as good as people think it is, or because they’re all bleeding? Combo maybe?
